Discussion:
Democrats show little appetite for gun control
(too old to reply)
Archangel
2009-03-03 22:36:46 UTC
Permalink
Democrats show little appetite for gun control
By JIM ABRAMS, Associated Press Writer Jim Abrams, Associated Press
Writer 59 mins ago
WASHINGTON – The National Rifle Association warned in a campaign ad that
if Barack Obama were elected president he would try to take away
hunters' guns and ammo. But with pro-gun Democrats a powerful force in
Congress, it's already pretty clear there will be no messing with
Americans' right to bear arms.
Twenty-two Democrats, including Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada,
joined Republicans last week in a Senate vote to negate the District of
Columbia's tough gun registration requirements and overturn its ban on
rapid-fire semiautomatic weapons. More than 80 House Democrats voted for
a similar measure last year.
"It was a pleasant surprise, but it's not a huge surprise that elected
officials are listening to their constituents," said Chris W. Cox, the
NRA's chief lobbyist.
It's not certain that the gun measure, attached to a bill on D.C. voting
rights, will be a part of the final version of that bill. But with six
of 11 Democratic Senate freshmen — from pro-gun states such as Alaska,
Colorado, New Mexico and Virginia — voting for the proposal, it was a
clear sign of where Congress is heading on gun issues.
"There has been a shift in thinking among Democrats in the last six to
eight years, away from old ideas about gun control and limiting access
to guns and toward ideas about how you actually reduce gun crime," said
Matt Bennett of Third Way, a group of moderate Democrats active on gun
control issues.
That shift has been frustrating for lawmakers who have long decried the
NRA's ability to block gun control legislation.
"We do not debate guns around here much anymore," said the Senate's no.
2 Democrat, Dick Durbin of Illinois, during debate on the D.C. gun
amendment. "Basically, we reached a point where there are not many
people who will stick their political necks out to vote for sensible gun
control — too big a hassle."
A case in point is new Democrat Kirsten Gillibrand, a steadfast gun
rights advocate when she represented a pro-gun, Republican-leaning
district in upstate New York. Her appointment to succeed Hillary Clinton
as New York's junior senator drew protests from gun-control Democrats,
but after she voted against the D.C. gun amendment Republicans accused
her of abandoning her principles for political expediency.
Gillibrand's spokesman, Matt Canter, said the senator supports Second
Amendment rights. But she also believes that local governments have the
right to put legitimate limits on firearms and that law enforcement must
have the tools to protect the public from gun violence, he said.
A major turning point came last June, when the Supreme Court, in a 5-4
vote overturning D.C.'s ban on handgun possession, confirmed that the
Second Amendment gives private citizens the right to bear arms.
Gun control advocates were consoled that the decision also specifies
that gun rights are not open-ended, that government can impose some
restrictions in the public interest.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090303/ap_on_go_co/gun_rights/print

Archangel.

Change you can believe in.


Clinton vows to work for creation of Palestinian state
by Sylvie Lanteaume Sylvie Lanteaume 1 hr 40 mins ago
JERUSALEM (AFP) – US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton pressed her
"aggressive" Middle East diplomacy on Tuesday, sending two envoys to
Syria and vowing to work towards the creation of a Palestinian state.
On her first visit to the region since being appointed by US President
Barack Obama, Clinton said she would pursue a comprehensive peace plan
while stressing that Israel could count on continued support from it
staunchest ally.
She announced she was sending two members of her delegation to Syria, a
longtime foe of the Jewish state with whom US relations have been
strained for years.
"There are a number of issues we have between Syria and the United
States as well as the larger regional concerns that Syria obviously
poses," she said after talks with outgoing Israeli Foreign Minister
Tzipi Livni,
Clinton also stressed the US commitment to the creation of a viable
Palestinian state living peacefully alongside Israel, a concept at the
heart of efforts to end the decades-old Middle East conflict.
"It is our assessment ... that eventually, the inevitability of working
toward a two-state solution is inescapable."
"The first step right now ... is a durable ceasefire," Clinton said.
"But that can only be achieved if Hamas ceases the rocket attacks."
Hamas, the Islamist rulers of Gaza, lashed out at the comments.
"The government considers the statements from Hillary Clinton to be the
height of bias towards the Israeli occupation," Hamas government
spokesman Taher al-Nunu said in a statement.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20090303/wl_afp/mideastdiplomacyus_20090303191203/print

Archangel.

Change you can believe in.

In twist, GOP likes Obama's Iraq plan, Democrats don't
By Mark Johnson, Ryan Teague Beckwith and Steven Thomma, McClatchy
Newspapers Mark Johnson, Ryan Teague Beckwith And Steven Thomma,
Mcclatchy Newspapers Fri Feb 27, 5:15 pm ET
CAMP LEJEUNE, N.C. — President Barack Obama announced here Friday that
he'll withdraw U.S. combat troops from Iraq by Aug. 31, 2010 , but his
plans to leave as many as 50,000 U.S. troops there through 2011 made
many Democrats in Congress angry, while Republicans cheered.
It was an ironic reception for a new commander-in-chief whose
presidential campaign was built initially on his early opposition to the
Iraq war and his promise to end it if elected.
"I am deeply troubled by the suggestion that a force of 50,000 troops
could remain in Iraq ," said Rep. Lynn Woolsey , D- Calif. "This is
unacceptable."
"I question whether such a large force is needed to combat any al Qaida
affiliates in Iraq or whether it will contribute to stability in the
region," said Sen. Russ Feingold , D- Wis.
"You cannot leave combat troops in a foreign country to conduct combat
operations and call it the end of the war. You can't be in and out at
the same time," said Rep. Dennis Kucinich , D- Ohio . "We must bring a
conclusion to this sorry chapter in American history."
The Republican Obama defeated in November for the presidency, Sen. John
McCain of Arizona , lauded the plan.
"We have spent enormous amounts of American blood in treasure in Iraq ,"
McCain said. "We are finally on a path to success. Let us have no crisis
of confidence now."
McCain said he agrees with Obama that the U.S. should keep 50,000 troops
in Iraq after the combat troops leave, following the recommendation of
U.S. military commander. He worries, however, about pressure on Obama
from Democrats urging a faster withdrawal.
"I worry . . . about statements made by a number of our colleagues
indicating that, for reasons wholly apart from the requirement to secure
our aims in Iraq , we should aim at a troop presence much lower," McCain
said. "The administration should . . . not succumb to pressures,
political or otherwise, to make deeper or faster cuts in our force levels."
The Republican leaders of the Senate and House of Representatives — Sen.
Mitch McConnell of Kentucky and Rep. John Boehner of Ohio — also issued
statements praising Obama's Iraq policy.
Obama traveled to Camp Lejeune to announce his Iraq policy — which had
leaked several days earlier — to a gym full of 2,700 Marines in
camouflage uniforms. Some 8,000 Marines at this base near Jacksonville,
N.C. , will ship out this spring to Afghanistan , where Obama is
escalating the U.S. presence.
The president said that, after nearly six years, it's time to end the
Iraq war.
"We cannot sustain indefinitely a commitment that has put a strain on
our military, and will cost the American people nearly a trillion
dollars," he said.
"America's men and women in uniform have fought block by block, province
by province, year after year, to give the Iraqis this chance to choose a
better future. Now, we must ask the Iraqi people to seize it."
He said he'd withdraw combat troops over the next 18 months — a bit
longer than his campaign promise to get out within 16 months. He said he
took the advice of military commanders on extending the timetable.
The pace of the drawdown will be left to the commanders and determined
by events on the ground as well as politics in Washington . Commanders
will be watching to ensure that they have enough troops there to
maintain the gains they've made and to safeguard national elections in
December.
Although U.S. and Iraqi casualties have dropped sharply, and recent
provincial elections were held without major incidents, it's not clear
whether Iraq's rival factions and their militias have abandoned violence
or are merely biding their time. Another factor that could disrupt
Obama's timetable will be the speed with which Iraqi military and
security forces gain the ability to maintain order without American help.
En route to Camp Lejeune , Obama called Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al
Maliki and then former President George W. Bush to tell each personally
about his timetable.
The controversy centers on his decision to leave a force of between
35,000 and 50,000 U.S. troops to train, equip and advise Iraqi forces,
help protect withdrawing forces and work on counterterrorism. They'd
remain until Dec. 31, 2011 , the date the Bush administration agreed to
withdraw all troops under a pact with Iraq .
That timetable too, could depend on conditions in Iraq and on the need
for additional U.S. troops in Afghanistan , where the Taliban has made
significant gains, and where national elections also are scheduled.
Democratic leaders in Congress were less overtly hostile to the residual
U.S. force than some of their members, but they, too, seemed to suggest
that they'd press Obama in months ahead to leave a smaller force behind
in Iraq than he announced.
"We must responsibly end the war in Iraq to make America more secure,
and must keep in Iraq only those forces necessary for the security of
our remaining troops and the Iraqi people," said Senate Majority Leader
Harry Reid , D- Nev.
"I look forward to further discussing this plan with the president and
working with him to ensure we are doing what is best for America's
security interests and ensuring our military remains the strongest
fighting force in history."
A day earlier, he told reporters that he didn't like the idea of keeping
that many troops in Iraq . "That's a little higher number than I had
anticipated," he said on Thursday.
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi , D- Calif. , left open the door to getting
more troops out of Iraq faster.
"As President Obama's Iraq policy is implemented, the remaining missions
given to our remaining forces must be clearly defined and narrowly
focused so that the number of troops needed to perform them is as small
as possible," she said.
Other prominent Democrats were more welcoming of Obama's plan.
Sen. John Kerry , D- Mass. , the chairman of the Senate Foreign
Relations Committee , called it a "responsible drawdown of the great
majority of American forces." He said that Obama "is correct to leave in
place a sufficient residual force to complete the training of Iraqi
security forces, protect our personnel, and conduct counterterrorism
missions."

Archangel.

Change you can believe in.
lorad
2009-03-03 22:44:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Archangel
Democrats show little appetite for gun control
By JIM ABRAMS, Associated Press Writer Jim Abrams, Associated Press
Writer 59 mins ago
WASHINGTON – The National Rifle Association warned in a campaign ad that
if Barack Obama were elected president he would try to take away
hunters' guns and ammo. But with pro-gun Democrats a powerful force in
Congress, it's already pretty clear there will be no messing with
Americans' right to bear arms.
Twenty-two Democrats, including Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada,
joined Republicans last week in a Senate vote to negate the District of
Columbia's tough gun registration requirements and overturn its ban on
rapid-fire semiautomatic weapons. More than 80 House Democrats voted for
a similar measure last year.
See? Anything is possible!

After decades of institutionalized stupidity, some democrats recognize
that trying to suppress CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS - might be a stupid
idea, after all..

Hillary won Pennsylvania because she partially saw the light.

PS to genetically rabid gun grabbers: Go grab yer own stuff.
Mitchell Holman
2009-03-04 14:09:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by lorad
Post by Archangel
Democrats show little appetite for gun control
By JIM ABRAMS, Associated Press Writer Jim Abrams, Associated Press
Writer 59 mins ago
WASHINGTON – The National Rifle Association warned in a campaign ad tha
t
Post by Archangel
if Barack Obama were elected president he would try to take away
hunters' guns and ammo. But with pro-gun Democrats a powerful force in
Congress, it's already pretty clear there will be no messing with
Americans' right to bear arms.
Twenty-two Democrats, including Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada,
joined Republicans last week in a Senate vote to negate the District of
Columbia's tough gun registration requirements and overturn its ban on
rapid-fire semiautomatic weapons. More than 80 House Democrats voted for
a similar measure last year.
See? Anything is possible!
After decades of institutionalized stupidity, some democrats recognize
that trying to suppress CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS - might be a stupid
idea, after all..
Hillary won Pennsylvania because she partially saw the light.
PS to genetically rabid gun grabbers: Go grab yer own stuff.
"I support the Brady Bill and I urge the Congress to
enact it without further delay." Ronald Reagan, 3/28/91




"As a longtime gun owner and supporter of the right
to bear arms, I, too, have carefully thought about
this issue. I am convinced that the limitations imposed
in this bill are absolutely necessary. I know there is
heavy pressure on you to go the other way, but I strongly
urge you to join me in supporting this bill. It must be
passed."
Ronald Reagan, supporting the assault weapon bill, 1994
lorad
2009-03-04 18:36:49 UTC
Permalink
See?  Anything is possible!
After decades of institutionalized stupidity, some democrats recognize
that trying to suppress CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS - might be a stupid
idea, after all..
Hillary won Pennsylvania because she partially saw the light.
PS to genetically rabid gun grabbers: Go grab yer own stuff.
 "I support the Brady Bill and I urge the Congress to
enact it without further delay." Ronald Reagan, 3/28/91
"As a longtime gun owner and supporter of the right
to bear arms, I, too, have carefully thought about
this issue. I am convinced that the limitations imposed
in this bill are absolutely necessary. I know there is
heavy pressure on you to go the other way, but I strongly
urge you to join me in supporting this bill. It must be
passed."
Ronald Reagan, supporting the assault weapon bill, 1994
Reagan was in full blown Alzheimers by 1994.. and probably already
crazy in 1991.. when he supported the relatively innocuous 'Brady
Bill'.. and not some 'assault weapons' ban. (All weapons are 'assault
weapons' - and necessarily so - just as food is necesariily
nutritious).

PS: An illegal beaner crawls through your window and starts stabbing
your mother.. what are you going to do?
Offer a plate of chalupas?
Get the telephone and call for help?
Could she last twenty minutes?
Could you?
Kickin' Ass and Takin' Names
2009-03-11 10:58:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by lorad
See?  Anything is possible!
After decades of institutionalized stupidity, some democrats recognize
that trying to suppress CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS - might be a stupid
idea, after all..
Hillary won Pennsylvania because she partially saw the light.
PS to genetically rabid gun grabbers: Go grab yer own stuff.
 "I support the Brady Bill and I urge the Congress to
enact it without further delay." Ronald Reagan, 3/28/91
"As a longtime gun owner and supporter of the right
to bear arms, I, too, have carefully thought about
this issue. I am convinced that the limitations imposed
in this bill are absolutely necessary. I know there is
heavy pressure on you to go the other way, but I strongly
urge you to join me in supporting this bill. It must be
passed."
Ronald Reagan, supporting the assault weapon bill, 1994
Reagan was in full blown Alzheimers by 1994.. and probably already
crazy in 1991.. when he supported the relatively innocuous 'Brady
Bill'.. and not some 'assault weapons' ban. (All weapons are 'assault
weapons' - and necessarily so - just as food is necesariily
nutritious).
PS: An illegal beaner crawls through your window and starts stabbing
your mother.. what are you going to do?
Offer a plate of chalupas?
Get the telephone and call for help?
Could she last twenty minutes?
Could you?- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Let's examine your scenario -- as you stated: " An illegal beaner
crawls through your window and starts stabbing your mother.. "

Perhaps you could cite statistics showing that this nation is
experiencing a widespread epidemic of "illegal beaners" crawling
through windows and stabbing people.

I'm 65 years old and, as the result of 28 years of military service,
I've lived all over the US (well, except for the NW -- never lived
there). Since retiring from the Army in 1995, I have lived in: E TN,
MS Gulf Coast, E TN, E VA. Am not aware of a SINGLE INCIDENT of an
"illegal beaner" crawling through a window and attacking anyone. Now,
I am aware of incidents of gunnuts "going postal" and blowing away
coworkers at factories and offices, in shopping malls, and at churches
-- and none of them was an "illegal beaner."

HOWEVER -- the original title of this thread was something about
"Democrats show little stomahc for gun control." Apparently you slept
through the 2008 Presidential and Congressional elections where NOT A
SINGLE CANDIDATE raved about gun-grabbers and assault weapons on the
streets (except, of course, for a few pro forma throw-away lines by
Sarah Palin). And why not??? Because the public is tired of being
jerked around by the NRA, whose executives beat the drums to raise
money for their corporate jets and million $$$ salaries by trying to
convince the sheep that someone is about to grab their guns.
Patriot Games
2009-03-11 14:51:36 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 11 Mar 2009 03:58:56 -0700 (PDT), "Kickin' Ass and Takin'
Post by Kickin' Ass and Takin' Names
I'm 65 years old and, as the result of 28 years of military service,
You were NEVER in the Military:

On Tue, 08 Jul 2008 12:08:42 -0400, Patriot Games
Post by Kickin' Ass and Takin' Names
On Tue, 8 Jul 2008 01:36:51 -0700 (PDT), "Kickin' Ass and Takin'
On Sun, 6 Jul 2008 18:22:11 -0700 (PDT), "Kickin' Ass and Takin'
There is no such thing as a recommendation for a Purple Heart.
Wrong.
MANUAL OF MILITARY DECORATIONS & AWARDS
Office of the Assistant Secretary of Defense
(Force Management Policy)
DoD 1348.33-M, September 1996
http://www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/corres/pdf/134833m.pdf
C3.3.2. All recommendations for Defense decorations
The key word here is "decorations."
Wrong. The important word used to CATCH YOU LYING, AGAIN, is
"Service" as in SERVICE AWARDS.
Military medals are of two types: AWARDS and DECORATIONS -- known to
anyone who has served a few minutes in uniform is "awards and decs."
Wrong. SERVICE AWARDS are NOT Decorations. The Purple Heart IS NOT a
Service Award.
The Purple Heart is an award, not a decoration.
Wrong. But thanks so much for the opportunity to PROVE CONCLUSIVELY
that YOU ARE A LIAR and that YOU HAVE NO MILITARY EXPERIENCE.
Once again, ol' PG has his ass handed to him.
Let's recap.
I provided CITED REFERENCES.
YOU are a PROVEN LIAR.
I provided ORIGINAL MILITARY DOCUMENTATION.
YOU, a PROVEN LIAR, provided WORTHLESS PERSONAL OPINION.
And now I will demonstrate using CITED ORIGINAL MILITARY DOCUMENTATION
MANUAL OF MILITARY DECORATIONS & AWARDS
Office of the Assistant Secretary of Defense
(Force Management Policy)
DoD 1348.33-M, September 1996
http://www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/corres/pdf/134833m.pdf
C1.1. PURPOSE
This Manual explains DoD policies and procedures on awarding Defense
decorations and SERVICE awards...
[...]
AP1. APPENDIX 1
U.S. MILITARY DECORATIONS
AP1.1.1. This Appendix contains a brief description of the various
decorations that have been authorized for the Armed Forces of the
[...]
AP1.1.2.21. PURPLE HEART
[...]
We NOW KNOW for a PROVEN FACT that YOU LIED about having ANY MILITARY
EXPERIENCE.
I hope you will enjoy having me post this again, and again, and again,
and again as much as I will enjoy posting it again, and again, and
again, and again.
YOU ARE NOW A TOTALLY DISCREDITED LIAR AND FRAUD!
Patriot Games
2009-03-11 14:52:27 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 11 Mar 2009 03:58:56 -0700 (PDT), "Kickin' Ass and Takin'
Post by Kickin' Ass and Takin' Names
I'm 65 years old and, as the result of 28 years of military service,
Did no one else notice what happened last week?
Commandant of the Marine Corps told the Secty of Defense that he wants
to pull all Marines out of Iraq, move a few to Afghanistan, and put
the rest of them back where they belong.
Secty of Defense Gates turned him down.
Sounds like cut and run to me.
==============================
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.politics/msg/fe1de766cd0b9381?hl=en&dmode=source

Subject: Marines want to cut and run from Iraq
Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2007 03:32:11 -0800 (PST)
Organization: http://groups.google.com
Message-ID:
<8b72f77e-f0e0-43bd-8128-***@e1g2000hsh.googlegroups.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 75.199.237.10
NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2007 11:32:12 +0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: e1g2000hsh.googlegroups.com;
posting-host=75.199.237.10;
posting-account=u8EbJwoAAACwPTiS-yGwA4_FF6JC1-l4

Did no one else notice what happened last week?

Commandant of the Marine Corps told the Secty of Defense that he wants
to pull all Marines out of Iraq, move a few to Afghanistan, and put
the rest of them back where they belong.

Secty of Defense Gates turned him down.

Sounds like cut and run to me.
==============================

Bert Hyman
2009-03-04 13:25:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Archangel
Democrats show little appetite for gun control
Not true.

Democrat Senators and Representatives have introduced many new
gun control bills in the current session.

It's only the Senate and House leadership, worried about their jobs, who
are limiting the bills' progress through the system.
--
Bert Hyman St. Paul, MN ***@iphouse.com
Mitchell Holman
2009-03-04 14:12:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bert Hyman
Post by Archangel
Democrats show little appetite for gun control
Not true.
Democrat Senators and Representatives have introduced many new
gun control bills in the current session.
It's only the Senate and House leadership, worried about their jobs, who
are limiting the bills' progress through the system.
Maybe another school shooting will change things?

Nah - not a chance.



Oct. 1, 1997
Pearl, Miss. Two students killed and seven wounded by Luke
Woodham, 16, who was also accused of killing his mother. He
and his friends were said to be outcasts who worshiped Satan.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.



Dec. 1, 1997
West Paducah, Ky. Three students killed, five wounded by Michael
Carneal, 14, as they participated in a prayer circle at Heath High
School.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


Dec. 15, 1997
Stamps, Ark. Two students wounded. Colt Todd, 14, was hiding in
the woods when he shot the students as they stood in the parking
lot.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


March 24, 1998
Jonesboro, Ark. Four students and one teacher killed, ten others
wounded outside as Westside Middle School emptied during a false
fire alarm. Mitchell Johnson, 13, and Andrew Golden, 11, shot at
their classmates and teachers from the woods.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.



April 24, 1998
Edinboro, Pa. One teacher, John Gillette, killed, two students
wounded at a dance at James W. Parker Middle School. Andrew Wurst,
14, was charged.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.



May 19, 1998
Fayetteville, Tenn. One student killed in the parking lot at
Lincoln County High School three days before he was to graduate.
The victim was dating the ex-girlfriend of his killer, 18-year-
old honor student Jacob Davis.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


May 21, 1998
Springfield, Ore. Two students killed, 22 others wounded in the
cafeteria at Thurston High School by 15-year-old Kip Kinkel. Kinkel
had been arrested and released a day earlier for bringing a gun to
school. His parents were later found dead at home.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


June 15, 1998
Richmond, Va. One teacher and one guidance counselor wounded by
a 14-year-old boy in the school hallway.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


April 20, 1999
Littleton, Colo. 14 students (including killers) and one teacher
killed, 23 others wounded at Columbine High School in the nation's
deadliest school shooting. Eric Harris, 18, and Dylan Klebold, 17,
had plotted for a year to kill at least 500 and blow up their school.
At the end of their hour-long rampage, they turned their guns on
themselves.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


May 20, 1999
Conyers, Ga. Six students injured at Heritage High School by
Thomas Solomon, 15, who was reportedly depressed after breaking
up with his girlfriend.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


Nov. 19, 1999
Deming, N.M. Victor Cordova Jr., 12, shot and killed Araceli Tena,
13, in the lobby of Deming Middle School.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


Dec. 6, 1999
Fort Gibson, Okla. Four students wounded as Seth Trickey, 13,
opened fire with a 9mm semiautomatic handgun at Fort Gibson
Middle School.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


Feb. 29, 2000
Mount Morris Township, Mich. Six-year-old Kayla Rolland shot dead
at Buell Elementary School near Flint, Mich. The assailant was
identified as a six-year-old boy with a .32-caliber handgun.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


May 26, 2000
Lake Worth, Fla. One teacher, Barry Grunow, shot and killed at
Lake Worth Middle School by Nate Brazill, 13, with .25-caliber
semiautomatic pistol on the last day of classes.

Gun laws changed in response - zero.



Santee, Calif. Two killed and 13 wounded by Charles Andrew
Williams, 15, firing from a bathroom at Santana High School.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.



March 7, 2001
Williamsport, Pa. Elizabeth Catherine Bush, 14, wounded student
Kimberly Marchese in the cafeteria of Bishop Neumann High School;
she was depressed and frequently teased.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


March 22, 2001
Granite Hills, Calif. One teacher and three students wounded
by Jason Hoffman, 18, at Granite Hills High School. A policeman
shot and wounded Hoffman.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.



March 30, 2001
Gary, Ind. One student killed by Donald R. Burt, Jr., a 17-
year-old student who had been expelled from Lew Wallace High
School.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


Nov. 12, 2001
Caro, Mich. Chris Buschbacher, 17, took two hostages at the
Caro Learning Center before killing himself.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.



Sept. 24, 2003
Cold Spring, Minn. Two students are killed at Rocori High
School by John Jason McLaughlin, 15.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.



March 21, 2005
Red Lake, Minn. Jeff Weise, 16, killed grandfather and companion,
then arrived at school where he killed a teacher, a security guard,
5 students, and finally himself, leaving a total of 10 dead.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.



Nov. 8, 2005
Jacksboro, Tenn. One 15-year-old shot and killed an assistant
principal at Campbell County High School and seriously wounded
two other administrators.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


Aug. 24, 2006
Essex, Vt. Christopher Williams, 27, looking for his ex-girlfriend
at Essex Elementary School, shot two teachers, killing one and
wounding another. Before going to the school, he had killed the
ex-girlfriend's mother.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


Sept. 26, 2006
Bailey, Colo. Adult male held six students hostage at Platte Canyon
High School and then shot and killed Emily Keyes, 16, and himself.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


Sept. 29, 2006
Cazenovia, Wis. A 15-year-old student shot and killed Weston
School principal John Klang.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.



Oct. 3, 2006
Nickel Mines, Pa. 32-year-old Carl Charles Roberts IV entered the
one-room West Nickel Mines Amish School and shot 10 schoolgirls,
ranging in age from 6 to 13 years old, and then himself. Five of
the girls and Roberts died.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.


Jan. 3, 2007
Tacoma, Wash. Douglas Chanthabouly, 18, shot fellow student
Samnang Kok, 17, in the hallway of Henry Foss High School.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.



April 16, 2007
Blacksburg, Va. A 23-year-old Virginia Tech student, Cho Seung-Hui,
killed two in a dorm, then killed 30 more 2 hours later in a
classroom building. His suicide brought the death toll to 33, making
the shooting rampage the most deadly in U.S. history. Fifteen others
were wounded.


Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Steve Thomas
2009-03-11 08:30:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bert Hyman
Post by Archangel
Democrats show little appetite for gun control
Not true.
Democrat Senators and Representatives have introduced many new
gun control bills in the current session.
It's only the Senate and House leadership, worried about their jobs, who
are limiting the bills' progress through the system.
    Maybe another school shooting will change things?
    Nah - not a chance.
Oct. 1, 1997
Pearl, Miss.  Two students killed and seven wounded by Luke
Woodham, 16, who was also accused of killing his mother. He
and his friends were said to be outcasts who worshiped Satan.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Dec. 1, 1997
West Paducah, Ky.  Three students killed, five wounded by Michael
Carneal, 14, as they participated in a prayer circle at Heath High
School.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Dec. 15, 1997
Stamps, Ark.  Two students wounded. Colt Todd, 14, was hiding in
the woods when he shot the students as they stood in the parking
lot.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
March 24, 1998
Jonesboro, Ark.  Four students and one teacher killed, ten others
wounded outside as Westside Middle School emptied during a false
fire alarm. Mitchell Johnson, 13, and Andrew Golden, 11, shot at
their classmates and teachers from the woods.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
April 24, 1998
Edinboro, Pa.  One teacher, John Gillette, killed, two students
wounded at a dance at James W. Parker Middle School. Andrew Wurst,
14, was charged.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
May 19, 1998
Fayetteville, Tenn.  One student killed in the parking lot at
Lincoln County High School three days before he was to graduate.
The victim was dating the ex-girlfriend of his killer, 18-year-
old honor student Jacob Davis.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
May 21, 1998
Springfield, Ore.  Two students killed, 22 others wounded in the
cafeteria at Thurston High School by 15-year-old Kip Kinkel. Kinkel
had been arrested and released a day earlier for bringing a gun to
school. His parents were later found dead at home.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
June 15, 1998
Richmond, Va.  One teacher and one guidance counselor wounded by
a 14-year-old boy in the school hallway.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
April 20, 1999
Littleton, Colo.  14 students (including killers) and one teacher
killed, 23 others wounded at Columbine High School in the nation's
deadliest school shooting. Eric Harris, 18, and Dylan Klebold, 17,
had plotted for a year to kill at least 500 and blow up their school.
At the end of their hour-long rampage, they turned their guns on
themselves.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
May 20, 1999
Conyers, Ga.  Six students injured at Heritage High School by
Thomas Solomon, 15, who was reportedly depressed after breaking
up with his girlfriend.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Nov. 19, 1999
Deming, N.M.  Victor Cordova Jr., 12, shot and killed Araceli Tena,
13, in the lobby of Deming Middle School.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Dec. 6, 1999
Fort Gibson, Okla.  Four students wounded as Seth Trickey, 13,
opened fire with a 9mm semiautomatic handgun at Fort Gibson
Middle School.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Feb. 29, 2000
Mount Morris Township, Mich.  Six-year-old Kayla Rolland shot dead
at Buell Elementary School near Flint, Mich. The assailant was
identified as a six-year-old boy with a .32-caliber handgun.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
May 26, 2000
Lake Worth, Fla.  One teacher, Barry Grunow, shot and killed at
Lake Worth Middle School by Nate Brazill, 13, with .25-caliber
semiautomatic pistol on the last day of classes.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Santee, Calif.  Two killed and 13 wounded by Charles Andrew
Williams, 15, firing from a bathroom at Santana High School.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
March 7, 2001
Williamsport, Pa.  Elizabeth Catherine Bush, 14, wounded student
Kimberly Marchese in the cafeteria of Bishop Neumann High School;
she was depressed and frequently teased.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
March 22, 2001
Granite Hills, Calif.  One teacher and three students wounded
by Jason Hoffman, 18, at Granite Hills High School. A policeman
shot and wounded Hoffman.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
March 30, 2001
Gary, Ind.  One student killed by Donald R. Burt, Jr., a 17-
year-old student who had been expelled from Lew Wallace High
School.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Nov. 12, 2001
Caro, Mich.  Chris Buschbacher, 17, took two hostages at the
Caro Learning Center before killing himself.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Sept. 24, 2003
Cold Spring, Minn.  Two students are killed at Rocori High
School by John Jason McLaughlin, 15.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
March 21, 2005
Red Lake, Minn. Jeff Weise, 16, killed grandfather and companion,
then arrived at school where he killed a teacher, a security guard,
5 students, and finally himself, leaving a total of 10 dead.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Nov. 8, 2005
Jacksboro, Tenn. One 15-year-old shot and killed an assistant
principal at Campbell County High School and seriously wounded
two other administrators.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Aug. 24, 2006
Essex, Vt. Christopher Williams, 27, looking for his ex-girlfriend
at Essex Elementary School, shot two teachers, killing one and
wounding another. Before going to the school, he had killed the
ex-girlfriend's mother.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Sept. 26, 2006
Bailey, Colo. Adult male held six students hostage at Platte Canyon
High School and then shot and killed Emily Keyes, 16, and himself.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Sept. 29, 2006
Cazenovia, Wis. A 15-year-old student shot and killed Weston
School principal John Klang.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Oct. 3, 2006
Nickel Mines, Pa. 32-year-old Carl Charles Roberts IV entered the
one-room West Nickel Mines Amish School and shot 10 schoolgirls,
ranging in age from 6 to 13 years old, and then himself. Five of
the girls and Roberts died.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Jan. 3, 2007
Tacoma, Wash. Douglas Chanthabouly, 18, shot fellow student
Samnang Kok, 17, in the hallway of Henry Foss High School.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
April 16, 2007
Blacksburg, Va. A 23-year-old Virginia Tech student, Cho Seung-Hui,
killed two in a dorm, then killed 30 more 2 hours later in a
classroom building. His suicide brought the death toll to 33, making
the shooting rampage the most deadly in U.S. history. Fifteen others
were wounded.
   Gun laws changed in response - zero.
Yes, we should let teachers and school security carry guns. Are you
ready to lobby for a law like that?
M***@dick.com
2009-03-04 17:41:09 UTC
Permalink
On 04 Mar 2009 13:25:07 GMT, Bert Hyman
Post by Bert Hyman
Post by Archangel
Democrats show little appetite for gun control
Not true.
So there ARE some honorable and committed people still
not falling for the Nazi Rifle Association's false
claims about the 2nd Amendment?
Scotius
2009-03-11 05:49:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Archangel
Democrats show little appetite for gun control
By JIM ABRAMS, Associated Press Writer Jim Abrams, Associated Press
Writer 59 mins ago
WASHINGTON – The National Rifle Association warned in a campaign ad that
if Barack Obama were elected president he would try to take away
hunters' guns and ammo. But with pro-gun Democrats a powerful force in
Congress, it's already pretty clear there will be no messing with
Americans' right to bear arms.
Twenty-two Democrats, including Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada,
joined Republicans last week in a Senate vote to negate the District of
Columbia's tough gun registration requirements and overturn its ban on
rapid-fire semiautomatic weapons. More than 80 House Democrats voted for
a similar measure last year.
"It was a pleasant surprise, but it's not a huge surprise that elected
officials are listening to their constituents," said Chris W. Cox, the
NRA's chief lobbyist.
It's not certain that the gun measure, attached to a bill on D.C. voting
rights, will be a part of the final version of that bill. But with six
of 11 Democratic Senate freshmen — from pro-gun states such as Alaska,
Colorado, New Mexico and Virginia — voting for the proposal, it was a
clear sign of where Congress is heading on gun issues.
"There has been a shift in thinking among Democrats in the last six to
eight years, away from old ideas about gun control and limiting access
to guns and toward ideas about how you actually reduce gun crime," said
Matt Bennett of Third Way, a group of moderate Democrats active on gun
control issues.
That shift has been frustrating for lawmakers who have long decried the
NRA's ability to block gun control legislation.
"We do not debate guns around here much anymore," said the Senate's no.
2 Democrat, Dick Durbin of Illinois, during debate on the D.C. gun
amendment. "Basically, we reached a point where there are not many
people who will stick their political necks out to vote for sensible gun
control — too big a hassle."
A case in point is new Democrat Kirsten Gillibrand, a steadfast gun
rights advocate when she represented a pro-gun, Republican-leaning
district in upstate New York. Her appointment to succeed Hillary Clinton
as New York's junior senator drew protests from gun-control Democrats,
but after she voted against the D.C. gun amendment Republicans accused
her of abandoning her principles for political expediency.
Gillibrand's spokesman, Matt Canter, said the senator supports Second
Amendment rights. But she also believes that local governments have the
right to put legitimate limits on firearms and that law enforcement must
have the tools to protect the public from gun violence, he said.
A major turning point came last June, when the Supreme Court, in a 5-4
vote overturning D.C.'s ban on handgun possession, confirmed that the
Second Amendment gives private citizens the right to bear arms.
Gun control advocates were consoled that the decision also specifies
that gun rights are not open-ended, that government can impose some
restrictions in the public interest.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090303/ap_on_go_co/gun_rights/print
Archangel.
Change you can believe in.
Clinton vows to work for creation of Palestinian state
by Sylvie Lanteaume Sylvie Lanteaume 1 hr 40 mins ago
JERUSALEM (AFP) – US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton pressed her
"aggressive" Middle East diplomacy on Tuesday, sending two envoys to
Syria and vowing to work towards the creation of a Palestinian state.
On her first visit to the region since being appointed by US President
Barack Obama, Clinton said she would pursue a comprehensive peace plan
while stressing that Israel could count on continued support from it
staunchest ally.
She announced she was sending two members of her delegation to Syria, a
longtime foe of the Jewish state with whom US relations have been
strained for years.
"There are a number of issues we have between Syria and the United
States as well as the larger regional concerns that Syria obviously
poses," she said after talks with outgoing Israeli Foreign Minister
Tzipi Livni,
Clinton also stressed the US commitment to the creation of a viable
Palestinian state living peacefully alongside Israel, a concept at the
heart of efforts to end the decades-old Middle East conflict.
"It is our assessment ... that eventually, the inevitability of working
toward a two-state solution is inescapable."
"The first step right now ... is a durable ceasefire," Clinton said.
"But that can only be achieved if Hamas ceases the rocket attacks."
Hamas, the Islamist rulers of Gaza, lashed out at the comments.
"The government considers the statements from Hillary Clinton to be the
height of bias towards the Israeli occupation," Hamas government
spokesman Taher al-Nunu said in a statement.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20090303/wl_afp/mideastdiplomacyus_20090303191203/print
Archangel.
Change you can believe in.
In twist, GOP likes Obama's Iraq plan, Democrats don't
By Mark Johnson, Ryan Teague Beckwith and Steven Thomma, McClatchy
Newspapers Mark Johnson, Ryan Teague Beckwith And Steven Thomma,
Mcclatchy Newspapers Fri Feb 27, 5:15 pm ET
CAMP LEJEUNE, N.C. — President Barack Obama announced here Friday that
he'll withdraw U.S. combat troops from Iraq by Aug. 31, 2010 , but his
plans to leave as many as 50,000 U.S. troops there through 2011 made
many Democrats in Congress angry, while Republicans cheered.
It was an ironic reception for a new commander-in-chief whose
presidential campaign was built initially on his early opposition to the
Iraq war and his promise to end it if elected.
"I am deeply troubled by the suggestion that a force of 50,000 troops
could remain in Iraq ," said Rep. Lynn Woolsey , D- Calif. "This is
unacceptable."
"I question whether such a large force is needed to combat any al Qaida
affiliates in Iraq or whether it will contribute to stability in the
region," said Sen. Russ Feingold , D- Wis.
"You cannot leave combat troops in a foreign country to conduct combat
operations and call it the end of the war. You can't be in and out at
the same time," said Rep. Dennis Kucinich , D- Ohio . "We must bring a
conclusion to this sorry chapter in American history."
The Republican Obama defeated in November for the presidency, Sen. John
McCain of Arizona , lauded the plan.
"We have spent enormous amounts of American blood in treasure in Iraq ,"
McCain said. "We are finally on a path to success. Let us have no crisis
of confidence now."
McCain said he agrees with Obama that the U.S. should keep 50,000 troops
in Iraq after the combat troops leave, following the recommendation of
U.S. military commander. He worries, however, about pressure on Obama
from Democrats urging a faster withdrawal.
"I worry . . . about statements made by a number of our colleagues
indicating that, for reasons wholly apart from the requirement to secure
our aims in Iraq , we should aim at a troop presence much lower," McCain
said. "The administration should . . . not succumb to pressures,
political or otherwise, to make deeper or faster cuts in our force levels."
The Republican leaders of the Senate and House of Representatives — Sen.
Mitch McConnell of Kentucky and Rep. John Boehner of Ohio — also issued
statements praising Obama's Iraq policy.
Obama traveled to Camp Lejeune to announce his Iraq policy — which had
leaked several days earlier — to a gym full of 2,700 Marines in
camouflage uniforms. Some 8,000 Marines at this base near Jacksonville,
N.C. , will ship out this spring to Afghanistan , where Obama is
escalating the U.S. presence.
The president said that, after nearly six years, it's time to end the
Iraq war.
"We cannot sustain indefinitely a commitment that has put a strain on
our military, and will cost the American people nearly a trillion
dollars," he said.
"America's men and women in uniform have fought block by block, province
by province, year after year, to give the Iraqis this chance to choose a
better future. Now, we must ask the Iraqi people to seize it."
He said he'd withdraw combat troops over the next 18 months — a bit
longer than his campaign promise to get out within 16 months. He said he
took the advice of military commanders on extending the timetable.
The pace of the drawdown will be left to the commanders and determined
by events on the ground as well as politics in Washington . Commanders
will be watching to ensure that they have enough troops there to
maintain the gains they've made and to safeguard national elections in
December.
Although U.S. and Iraqi casualties have dropped sharply, and recent
provincial elections were held without major incidents, it's not clear
whether Iraq's rival factions and their militias have abandoned violence
or are merely biding their time. Another factor that could disrupt
Obama's timetable will be the speed with which Iraqi military and
security forces gain the ability to maintain order without American help.
En route to Camp Lejeune , Obama called Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al
Maliki and then former President George W. Bush to tell each personally
about his timetable.
The controversy centers on his decision to leave a force of between
35,000 and 50,000 U.S. troops to train, equip and advise Iraqi forces,
help protect withdrawing forces and work on counterterrorism. They'd
remain until Dec. 31, 2011 , the date the Bush administration agreed to
withdraw all troops under a pact with Iraq .
That timetable too, could depend on conditions in Iraq and on the need
for additional U.S. troops in Afghanistan , where the Taliban has made
significant gains, and where national elections also are scheduled.
Democratic leaders in Congress were less overtly hostile to the residual
U.S. force than some of their members, but they, too, seemed to suggest
that they'd press Obama in months ahead to leave a smaller force behind
in Iraq than he announced.
"We must responsibly end the war in Iraq to make America more secure,
and must keep in Iraq only those forces necessary for the security of
our remaining troops and the Iraqi people," said Senate Majority Leader
Harry Reid , D- Nev.
"I look forward to further discussing this plan with the president and
working with him to ensure we are doing what is best for America's
security interests and ensuring our military remains the strongest
fighting force in history."
A day earlier, he told reporters that he didn't like the idea of keeping
that many troops in Iraq . "That's a little higher number than I had
anticipated," he said on Thursday.
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi , D- Calif. , left open the door to getting
more troops out of Iraq faster.
"As President Obama's Iraq policy is implemented, the remaining missions
given to our remaining forces must be clearly defined and narrowly
focused so that the number of troops needed to perform them is as small
as possible," she said.
Other prominent Democrats were more welcoming of Obama's plan.
Sen. John Kerry , D- Mass. , the chairman of the Senate Foreign
Relations Committee , called it a "responsible drawdown of the great
majority of American forces." He said that Obama "is correct to leave in
place a sufficient residual force to complete the training of Iraqi
security forces, protect our personnel, and conduct counterterrorism
missions."
Archangel.
Change you can believe in.
Despite the pronouncements and blather of deluded liberals
shills on this newsgroup, the election of Obama was not an affirmation
of the anti-gun "beliefs" of some among the radical left. It was an
election against obvious crookery among the Republicans. That's what
it was. The Dems don't have a big appetite for gun control because
they don't want to put their new popularity in the toilet.
Continue reading on narkive:
Loading...